A dialogue between Christine Liu, Founder of sHero, and Xiangwei Gong, President, DSM Hydrocolloids
12.18.2017
女性领导力组织sHero创始人刘慧和帝斯曼亲水胶体总裁龚湘伟的一场对话
Click for Part 1，Part 2，and Part 3
点击打开第一部，第二部和第三部
Part 4
第四部分
C: Wow, that’s really amazing. Looking forward to the next chapter of your life and your career, so anything, you know, plans you may have, you want to share in a different perspective at this time of your life and your career?
C: 哇，这真的太棒了，在你期待着你的生活和事业的下一个篇章时候，从你现在所处的人生和职业生涯，以不同的角度，你有什么计划或者任何事情想分享的吗？
XW: Well, it’s actually amazing, and it feels amazing, you ask this question. Right now, you know… I am forty-eight, really middle age, that’s …if I am lucky and I live to a hundred, I already spent a half. But image this, when I was younger, I thought probably, oh my God, that age, that’s awful and that’s so old. And…and probably, I am old to many people. But on the other hand, when I think about what I have done already, I have all these obligations behind me almost, all the things that I have to do... to, you know ...the college, and get a job and make a living and have children... It’s all done, wow! I still have all these years left, and I am not in a rush anymore, so I cannot tell you what I will do and what I will become in the next fifty years, all I can say is that it’s just unimaginable.
I think many many opportunities will open up, I think it will be amazing, it will be great... it will be great. But what’s important is to keep the ... the… actually the body, the brain, the heart to be in shape. You… it will be difficult to have anything lagging, I think it is where you need to align, you need to align your energy, your heart with your wisdom. And if you...I am not there, but I am constantly pursuing that, to find that perfect alignment where your heart is, your mind is, and you have the body to enable that.
XW: 实际上，我感觉很神奇，你这样问我，很神奇。关于你问的问题，我现在48岁，真的是人到中年了，如果我很幸运能活到一百岁的话，我现在已经度过了我人生一半的光阴。但是，想象一下，在我年轻的时候，我那时候觉得，我的天哪，那个年纪实在太糟糕了，太老了。也许，也许对于很多人来说我确是老了。但是另一方面，当我想到我已经完成的事情，几乎我所有的责任都将要过去，你知道的，那些必须做到事情，学业，找工作，谋生，孩子，这些都已经是完成时了，Wow！ 而我还剩下这么多的时间，我再也不慌张了。而关于接下来的50年我要做什么、我要成为谁，我只能告诉你这可以用超乎想象来形容。
我觉得未来充满机遇，这将会非常精彩，将会很棒。最重要的实际上是要保持好身体、大脑和心灵的状况。身体需要保持好。你知道的…...缺乏任何一项都会十分的困难，这是你需要达成一致的地方，与你的能量，心灵与智慧相结合。我现在还没有达到那种境界，但我正在不断地追求中。去找寻一个在身体状态支持下，心灵与大脑的结合。但如果你…我正在不断地追求中，去追求心灵与大脑的完美结合，并拥有能不断促成那样的完美结合的身体。
C: Wow, when you…when you talk about that, you know, when we sometimes, we’re just thinking about how we can help young women to be the leaders for tomorrow... And what stops them, in the sense of lack of confidence, or too many worries, or they don't have role models? So you may share one thing, you know, for them at this moment.
C: 哇, 当你……当你说到这些的时候，你知道，有的时候，我们会只想到该如何帮助年轻女性成为明日的领袖...... 到底是什么在阻碍她们成长？是自信心的缺乏，过度忧虑，或没有合适的榜样？您是否能在此就一个方面对年轻女性们做一些分享。
XW: I think all the things you mentioned play a part, I'm sure. We tend to add a lot of pressure and look very short term, thinking that we have no time. I need to do this, I need to do that, I need to become this and that, and in very short timeline. And that pressure whether from the society or from your family or from yourself makes you actually very short-sighted, and therefore, actually (it) takes away the time of thinking and really putting in real efforts. So you need to find the combination and it is…it is not easy.
When I was young, I also felt like, oh I got to do these before 30, one, two, three, four. ... Okay, if you really feel you have to do it, then do it. So you always need to set the priorities. And there was always priority. The timeline is actually quite important. If you want to…if being a mother is part of your goal, then don't think too much, do it. But then do it and don't whine, or complain about what you have lost. You…I think you can have a lot if you expand your horizon, your timeline. But don't expect to have everything done in these two years. Have clarity in your head. it's very important to have that clarity. And then yeah…and do not have too much pressure because the pressure is….it doesn't ... doesn't really help.
XW: 我认为您刚才所谈及的所有这些都起着一定的作用。我很确信。我们倾向于将很多的压力都加在身上，并且非常目光浅短地认为自己没有时间。在短时间内，（觉得）我需要做这个，做那个，成为这个或是那个。这种压力无论是来自于社会，家庭亦或自己其实都让我们变得极其短视， 其实也让我们没有时间去做思考，并付出真正的努力。要找到（长期和短期）的平衡点并不容易。
我年轻的时候，我也觉得自己要在30岁之前完成这些事情，一、二、三、四。......好，当你真的想要去做件事，那么就去做。只是你总要有个优先顺序，做事的时间轴设定也很重要。如果成为一名母亲是你目标的一部分，那么不要想太多，就去做就好。但是去做的时候，一定不要对你所失去的产生不满和抱怨。你…...我认为如果你开阔了视野，延长了时间线，你可以拥有很多。但是，永远不要期待可以在两年内完成时所有的事情。对这些事情你要有个清晰的大脑。保持大脑的清晰这一点十分重要。与此同时，不要过度给自己压力，因为压力它……并不能……不能对你有所帮助。
C: It doesn't really solve, you know, the problems.
C: 这不能帮助解决问题。
XW：Yes. so I like this… I like this quote from the CEO of LinkedIn Jeff Weiner.
XW: 是的。所以我喜欢……我喜欢领英首席执行官Jeff Weiner的一句话。
C: What is that?
C: 是什么呢？
XW: Who says he likes to work with three kinds of people. So, I read if you have all the three qualities in one, then it’s perfect. So, the three kinds of people in his organization, he said, “Dream big. And get shit done. And know how to have fun.” The three qualities of people. But I think that it’d be great if you have all the three qualities.
I actually...actully think about that all the time. So, I still want to dream big, but every day I still need to take care of things I don’t like to do. And then in that process, I need to have fun. And don’t lose that fun part. The part… fun gives you the source of inspiration for something more. Without fun, you can’t sustain. So also, the fun part, I think, in a way, is the connecting dots, like what Jobs said, “connecting dots”. If what you’re doing every day, don’t connect to the big dream, then you should quit. So, you need to find connection. You never know how this will connect, but you need be really really mindful about that. So, dream big, get shit done and in that process, have fun and connect. Constantly realign and connect those dots.
XW: 他说他喜欢和三种人一起工作。所以我的解读是，如果你集三者于一身，那就完美了。那么，他公司的这三种人，他说是：梦想够大，什么屁事都能干好，而且要会玩。这三种特质。不过我认为人要把三者集齐于一身，就很棒。
其实，其实我经常思考这个问题。我也依然想有更大的梦想, 每天我也依然需要处理好我所不喜欢的日常琐事，在这过程中，我还需要有乐趣。而且不能丢掉乐趣这一部分。这部分…...乐趣会是我们灵感的源泉，启发我们畅想更多。而且，我认为乐趣在某种意义上说会连接生命中的点滴，就像乔布斯说的“将生命中的点连接起来”。如果那些每天让你忙碌的事务，不能与梦想联系起来，那你应该停下来。你应该找到这个关连点。你无法得知，你每天做的事情是如何与未来的梦想连接的，但你应该有意识地去留意。所以，梦想远大，做事踏实，而在这过程中，享受生活，连接当下与未来。不断地重新调整和审视这些点滴。
C: Wow, so you did have a very rich career path with 20 plus years across industries, functions, and also continents especially, the very solid track record of, you know, in both functional and leadership positions, which you are proud of yourself. But in the same time, you are also a world citizen. You’ve lived and worked in numerous locations. What is that kind of experience, especially for the young generation of China, and also for women, as observations, kind of, in terms of opportunities?
C: 你确实有着非常丰富的职业生涯，20多年来跨行业、职位，尤其跨洲际的工作经验，在不同的职能部门和领导角色都有非常成功的记录。这个我相信你也很骄傲。而同时，你也是一个全球公民。你在很多地方生活和工作过。对于中国年轻一代来讲，尤其是女性来讲，你观察到了什么？哪些机遇？
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